WTF is a "lone terrorist"? http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/ny-ussena093214085apr09,0,386... "A bill to expand the ability of the government to conduct wiretaps and other surveillance on suspected lone terrorists has attracted controversial amendments that have stalled its advance to the full Senate. Judiciary Committee Chairman Orrin Hatch (R-Utah) has circulated one amendment that would eliminate the sunset provision in the anti-terror Patriot Act that passed in the aftermath of Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks and greatly expanded the government's law enforcement powers. " Reading down it looks like a "lone terrorist" is someone that the government can't even prove is a "terrorist" to the secret FISA rubberstamp court. So this is presumeably an attempt to bypass FISA entirely.
On Wednesday, April 9, 2003, at 12:05 PM, Eric Murray wrote:
WTF is a "lone terrorist"?
http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/ny- ussena093214085apr09,0,3864424.story?coll=ny-nationalnews-headlines
"A bill to expand the ability of the government to conduct wiretaps and other surveillance on suspected lone terrorists has attracted controversial amendments that have stalled its advance to the full Senate. ... Reading down it looks like a "lone terrorist" is someone that the government can't even prove is a "terrorist" to the secret FISA rubberstamp court. So this is presumeably an attempt to bypass FISA entirely.
They claim to no longer need to prove that a person was planning a terrorist act. They claim that merely having terrorist tools is enough. There are several pending examples of this, discussed here. One guy up in the Northwest is facing terrorism charges for possibly thinking about possibly making ricin, possibly to poison his wife. No, I'm not talking about Jim Bell. Here's a URL: <http://www.guardian.co.uk/uslatest/story/0,1282,-2542993,00.html> "Olsen would face life in prison if convicted of the federal charge of possession of a biological agent or toxin for use as a weapon. " A good thing Bell was not being charged during the Permanent War. (Also a good time to get rid of those teflon-coated frying pans. P.S. Don't do a Google search in this area, especially in the area of making Sarin and other agents using home kitchen and garage ingredients unless you are aware that Google has hired many former spooks to help coordinate their very voluntary snooping and narcing on user searches.) --Tim May "We are at war with Oceania. We have always been at war with Oceania." "We are at war with Eurasia. We have always been at war with Eurasia." "We are at war with Iraq. We have always been at war with Iraq. "We are at war with France. We have always been at war with France."
It's just like with JFK - the CIA wanted Lee Harvey Oswald to be "the lone gunman" so if you have a nutcase, you don't have a conspiracy. Too bad it surfaced that Oswald had been to Mexico and had ties to the CIA and that the bullets fired didn't match the location of the book repository, etc. So, now we have a "Lone Terrorist" as a class of patsy to use at whim. Usually will be the Arab immigrant unable to secure legal aid anyhow. Once established, anyone can be the patsy. When Uncle Sam wants to disappear someone, they become "The Lone Terrorist." Simple, sweet, clean. The sheep will buy it. "He was a lone terrorist, kept to himself, valued his privacy..." Funny how we went from the Declaration of Independence that says "We hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness" to enumerate such rights in the Bill of Rights, to the USA PATRIOT act which removes all Liberty and due process at the slightest whim of any burrowcrat in the right agency. There was some Asimov robot story about this world where the robots' laws were bypassed by changing the definition of human to those from a specific planet only, thus having the robots kill outsiders to defend them. Eventually they tweaked it so deeply that the robots killed everyone. This is a pretty standard sci-fi theme. In this case, "citizen" goes away, as do rights. "He's not a citizen, he's a lone terrorist." Ditto "protected witness" and "illegal combattant" as a way to remove rights. It's has not been 98'C for quite some time now, and the frog has long been boiled. ----------------------Kaos-Keraunos-Kybernetos--------------------------- + ^ + :NSA got $20Bil/year |Passwords are like underwear. You don't /|\ \|/ :and didn't stop 9-11|share them, you don't hang them on your/\|/\ <--*-->:Instead of rewarding|monitor, or under your keyboard, you \/|\/ /|\ :their failures, we |don't email them, or put them on a web \|/ + v + :should get refunds! |site, and you must change them very often. --------_sunder_@_sunder_._net_------- http://www.sunder.net ------------ On Wed, 9 Apr 2003, Eric Murray wrote:
WTF is a "lone terrorist"?
In article <94E17E06-6AC7-11D7-9925-000A956B4C74@got.net>, Tim May <timcmay@got.net> wrote:
There are several pending examples of this, discussed here. One guy up in the Northwest is facing terrorism charges for possibly thinking about possibly making ricin, possibly to poison his wife. No, I'm not talking about Jim Bell. Here's a URL:
<http://www.guardian.co.uk/uslatest/story/0,1282,-2542993,00.html>
This article does not say that he was charged with "possibly thinking about possibly making ricin". It says he was charged with actually producing hundreds of lethal doses of it. -- Shields.
On Wed, Apr 09, 2003 at 01:12:25PM -0700, Tim May wrote:
On Wednesday, April 9, 2003, at 12:05 PM, Eric Murray wrote:
WTF is a "lone terrorist"?
http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/ny- ussena093214085apr09,0,3864424.story?coll=ny-nationalnews-headlines
"A bill to expand the ability of the government to conduct wiretaps and other surveillance on suspected lone terrorists has attracted controversial amendments that have stalled its advance to the full Senate. ... Reading down it looks like a "lone terrorist" is someone that the government can't even prove is a "terrorist" to the secret FISA rubberstamp court. So this is presumeably an attempt to bypass FISA entirely.
They claim to no longer need to prove that a person was planning a terrorist act. They claim that merely having terrorist tools is enough.
There are several pending examples of this, discussed here. One guy up in the Northwest is facing terrorism charges for possibly thinking about possibly making ricin, possibly to poison his wife. No, I'm not talking about Jim Bell. Here's a URL:
<http://www.guardian.co.uk/uslatest/story/0,1282,-2542993,00.html>
"Olsen would face life in prison if convicted of the federal charge of possession of a biological agent or toxin for use as a weapon. "
Holy shit -- a cigarette falls under that classification. There's enough nicotine in one to kill anyone if simply extracted. -- Harmon Seaver CyberShamanix http://www.cybershamanix.com
participants (5)
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Eric Murray -
Harmon Seaver -
Michael Shields -
Sunder -
Tim May