So, now the question is, what do we do? The logical answer would be to start testing them. Whomever is good with web apps written in Ruby could set up an instance or two of the Smallest Federated Wiki for us to test. Porting some of the stuff from the Google Pages over to it would be a good way to put it through its paces. Once they're up, getting them working over Tor would be the next logical step. I've got a copy of Fossil installed on Windbringer to play around with. Installing it is pretty straightforward. The workflow is different from Git, though, so it takes some getting used to. I'm working on a cribsheet of how to do practical stuff with it immediately (along the lines of the Git In 20 Commands page that the Linux kernel team used to have), which I'll post to this list. I'll put together a Fossil repository of stuff for us to mess around with - probably some of the ZS Google Pages. When a few folks are working on it, I'll throw a server on a Tor node and we can practice synching our respective copies that way. Litter's been fun to play with, and I'd suggest that others do as well. You need Python 2 installed on your machine, but that's it, it's based entirely on the libraries that come with Python by default. I've forked the project on Github because I plan on doing some work on it - it's got potential for use in Byzantium. I still haven't tried it over Tor; because it uses IP multicasting it might not work. None of the research I've done shows that IP multicasting over Tor works. Torchat is pretty nifty. I've used the python version a bit and it seems pretty stable. I don't know why the primary maintainer is rewriting it in Pascal but there should be binary-only downloads available when it's ready. That's my primary concern, that it's written in an odd language, but that's probably my language prejudices talking. As the name suggests, it's married to Tor because it uses the hidden service naming scheme to find people on the buddy list (but they can be aliased to more understandable names). No group chat that I know of. I haven't had time to mess with Tahoe-LAFS since the last Byzantium dev sprint, so I can't really speak to it. I had problems with it but Haxwithaxe and Sitwon didn't. So, that's on my hit list of things to do in the near future. More to come. SocialVPN hasn't been touched since 2011, and besides that there is a chance that XMPP server operators would start finding ways of blocking it because it basically means that you'd be running all of your network traffic through their server. That's a serious bandwidth sink, and it's not well understood how many people (or how much traffic) would bring a server to its knees. All things considered, wrecking someone's XMPP server by running a parasitic VPN over it is against a couple of the Principles, so it's out. I haven't done anything with any of the Github-like software mentioned earlier, so I can't speak to it. If anyone sets up an instance or two, your opinions would be welcome. Maybe we need them, maybe we won't (i.e., Fossil or something else). I still like YaCy, and still need more disk space for it. -- The Doctor [412/724/301/703] [ZS] https://drwho.virtadpt.net/ "I am everywhere." -- -- Zero State mailing list: http://groups.google.com/group/DoctrineZero ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com http://postbiota.org 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE