Gestapo harasses John Young, appeals to patriotism, told to fuck off
Cryptome received a visit today from FBI Special Agents Todd Renner and Christopher Kelly from the FBI Counterterrorism Office in New York, 26 Federal Plaza, telephone 212) 384-1000. Both agents presented official ID and business cards.
Good stuff. Pigs getting concerned about cryptome means they are scared.
Not scared, hungry. They're looking for more "collars" they can throw in jail so they meet their quotas. ----------------------Kaos-Keraunos-Kybernetos--------------------------- + ^ + :25Kliters anthrax, 38K liters botulinum toxin, 500 tons of /|\ \|/ :sarin, mustard and VX gas, mobile bio-weapons labs, nukular /\|/\ <--*-->:weapons.. Reasons for war on Iraq - GWB 2003-01-28 speech. \/|\/ /|\ :Found to date: 0. Cost of war: $800,000,000,000 USD. \|/ + v + : The look on Sadam's face - priceless! --------_sunder_@_sunder_._net_------- http://www.sunder.net ------------ On Sat, 8 Nov 2003, Anonymous wrote:
Cryptome received a visit today from FBI Special Agents Todd Renner and Christopher Kelly from the FBI Counterterrorism Office in New York, 26 Federal Plaza, telephone 212) 384-1000. Both agents presented official ID and business cards.
Good stuff. Pigs getting concerned about cryptome means they are scared.
On Nov 8, 2003, at 11:06 AM, Anonymous wrote:
Cryptome received a visit today from FBI Special Agents Todd Renner and Christopher Kelly from the FBI Counterterrorism Office in New York, 26 Federal Plaza, telephone 212) 384-1000. Both agents presented official ID and business cards.
Good stuff. Pigs getting concerned about cryptome means they are scared.
I don't understand how this "Anonymous" can title a post with the phrase "told to fuck off" when John Young's account clearly said that he allowed the Feebs to enter his area and even had them sitting on either side of him. I cannot claim to know what I would do, or will do, if Feds ever visit my home, but I hope I will have the presence of mind to tell them to: a) get off my property b) or to arrest me In either case, talking to them will not help. The way the Reichssecuritat is getting convictions these days is to charge sheeple with "lying to Federal agents." Nothing in the Constitution allows compelled speech, except under limited (and I think unconstitutional) cases involving grand juries ordering a person to speak. (Or where use or blanket immunity has been granted, again, probably an unconstitutional measure, as it is compelling potentially self-incriminating evidence which may very well be used in either another case or be twisted to provide a basis for another case.) I hope I will have the self-presence to say "You are trespassing. Get off my property, right now!" Cooperating with cops snooping around looking for either thoughtcrime or "terrorist aid and support" is a lose, a big lose. Speculating wildly, the real target may be John Young himself. And nearly anything he said to these narcs may be construed, by them and by their malleable DAs, as "lying to a Federal investigator." People should not talk to the Feds. If the Feds come calling, refer them to one's lawyer. For those who don't have a lawyer on retainer, tell them that you need to consult with a lawyer first. Whether you do or you don't is beside the point. The point is to not talk to them. "Lying to a Federal investigator" is how they probably hope to get Cryptome shut down and John's kind of dissent quelled. --Tim May
On Tue, Nov 11, 2003 at 09:01:00PM -0800, Tim May wrote:
People should not talk to the Feds. If the Feds come calling, refer them to one's lawyer. For those who don't have a lawyer on retainer, tell them that you need to consult with a lawyer first. Whether you do or you don't is beside the point. The point is to not talk to them.
This is sound advice of course, as is the point about not inviting federal police into your home. When I was served with the Carl Johnson subpoena, I had had a party the night before and one fellow (a 20something sysadmin from Baltimore) was asleep on the couch in the front room. At the sound of the doorbell, he opened the door and let the federal process server into the front hallway. Moral of this story is to make sure your houseguests know your house rules. Even if you don't have a lawyer on retainer, and I suspect few folks here do, saying you need to consult with one will provide you with time to give the local ACLU affiliate a call. Also law school legal clinics can be useful sources of free advice in a pinch. -Declan
Declan wrote:
Even if you don't have a lawyer on retainer, and I suspect few folks here do, saying you need to consult with one will provide you with time to give the local ACLU affiliate a call. Also law school legal clinics can be useful sources of free advice in a pinch.
I've consulted a lawyer or two about Cryptome, and their advice is don't do it, but if you do we're here. So I no longer ask for legal advice. My advice, and it's legally superior to legal advice: take care of yourself, the threats are not as bad as the advisors advise. Most lawyers I've dealt with advise to get along with the system, which may be sound legal advice but shitty for dissent. I spend several thousand dollars a year on legal services for business and personal matters, but not for Cryptome. Abiding legal advice would kill the varmint. I once proposed to Declan that he get thrown in jail for his reporting, to give a big boost to his credibility and career, to break away from the getalong pack. That was in Tacoma, in the Federal Courthouse cafeteria, taking a break from the Bell show trial. I'd like to visit Declan in the pokey, sneak him a tube of getalong lubricant.
participants (5)
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Anonymous -
Declan McCullagh -
John Young -
Sunder -
Tim May