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R. A. Hettinga

5 Aug 2003 5 Aug '03

2:14 p.m.

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Bill Stewart

6 Aug 6 Aug

4:43 a.m.

Bob - Perry's cryptography list moved from wasabisystems to cryptography@metzdowd.com a few months ago. Majordomo@metzdowd.com says: -----------------------------------------------------

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lists majordomo@metzdowd.com serves the following lists:

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info cryptography "Cryptography" is a low-noise moderated mailing list devoted to cryptographic technology and its political impact. Occasionally,

bsd-api-announce The BSD APIs Announcement Mailing List bsd-api-discuss The BSD APIs Discussion Mailing List cryptography The Cryptography and Cryptography Policy Mailing List spki The Simple PKI Mailing List Use the 'info <list>' command to get more information about a specific list. the moderator allows the topic to veer more generally into security and privacy technology and its impact, but this is rare. WHAT TOPICS ARE APPROPRIATE: "On topic" discussion includes technical aspects of cryptosystems, social repercussions of cryptosystems, and the politics of cryptography such as export controls or laws restricting cryptography. Discussions unrelated to cryptography are considered off topic. Please try to keep your postings on topic. MODERATION POLICY: In order to keep the signal to noise ratio high, the mailing list is moderated. The moderator does not forward off topic messages, messages that have substantially the same content as earlier messages, etc. Please not that the moderator does not always have the time to send an explanation of why a message was not forwarded. TO POST: send mail with your message to cryptography@metzdowd.com TO UNSUBSCRIBE: send mail to majordomo@metzdowd.com with the line unsubscribe cryptography in the body of your mail.

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info spki #### No info available for spki. end END OF COMMANDS

R. A. Hettinga

10:13 a.m.

At 1:28 AM -0700 8/6/03, Bill Stewart wrote:

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Bob - Perry's cryptography list moved from wasabisystems to cryptography@metzdowd.com

I haven't gotten anything from there, either. Perry got sick a while back, and, if he's not in jail or something, :-), I bet that's it. Cheers, RAH -- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation http://www.ibuc.com/ 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

R. A. Hettinga

11:38 a.m.

At 9:55 AM -0400 8/6/03, R. A. Hettinga wrote:

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Perry got sick a while back, and, if he's not in jail or something, :-), I bet that's it.

Let me clarify that. A while ago, Perry got sick. The list was down for quite a while. Then he got better, and the list came back. I bet that's what's happening now. If he's not in jail. :-). Cheers, RAH But, seriously, folks... -- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation http://www.ibuc.com/ 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

Adam Back

2:20 p.m.

The problems with closed lists relying on a single human for forwarding and filtering... Couldn't he just let people post in his absence? It kind of detracts from a list if it disappears for weeks at a time on a regular basis. Also there are delays, and then there's Perry decisions that a discussion is no longer worth persuing when contributors are still interested to discuss. Adam On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 11:18:32AM -0400, R. A. Hettinga wrote:

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At 9:55 AM -0400 8/6/03, R. A. Hettinga wrote:

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Perry got sick a while back, and, if he's not in jail or something, :-), I bet that's it.

Let me clarify that. A while ago, Perry got sick. The list was down for quite a while. Then he got better, and the list came back. I bet that's what's happening now. If he's not in jail. :-).

Cheers, RAH But, seriously, folks... -- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation http://www.ibuc.com/ 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'

Tim May

3:03 p.m.

On Wednesday, August 6, 2003, at 11:05 AM, Adam Back wrote:

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The problems with closed lists relying on a single human for forwarding and filtering...

Couldn't he just let people post in his absence? It kind of detracts from a list if it disappears for weeks at a time on a regular basis.

Also there are delays, and then there's Perry decisions that a discussion is no longer worth persuing when contributors are still interested to discuss.

Adam

I enjoyed interacting with Perry about 10-11 years ago, mostly on the Extropians list. Perry was a major political ranter (even if it is not true that he coined the phrase "Utopia is not an option"). (Extropians was a privately-owned list, and what eventually drove me away was the silliness involving "trials" for those accused of insulting others, or violating some rules, or disrespecting the Official Beliefs. I attribute this silliness not to malice by the Extropian Maximum Leaders, but by the very nature of private lists and the almost unavoidable tendency to try to "perfect" lists by tweaking what people can and can't say.) I despise people's private fiefdoms, whether Dave Farber's "Interesting People" list or Lewis McCarthy's "Coderpunks" list or any of Bob Hettinga's various "BearerBunks" and "Phisodex" lists. And Perrypunks, with its quixotic policy about politics (politics banned, except when Perry wanted to rant), was just another private fiefdom. I don't dispute their property right to do with their machines as they wish, absent contracts, but being in their fiefdoms chafes very quickly. The distributed CP list may end up being the last list left standing, at least in this niche. Part of the reason Usenet continues to thrive, despite its flaws. --Tim May "That the said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." --Samuel Adams

Bill Stewart

4:55 p.m.

At 07:05 PM 08/06/2003 +0100, Adam Back wrote:

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The problems with closed lists relying on a single human for forwarding and filtering...

Couldn't he just let people post in his absence? It kind of detracts from a list if it disappears for weeks at a time on a regular basis.

Also there are delays, and then there's Perry decisions that a discussion is no longer worth persuing when contributors are still interested to discuss.

If it's too quiet on Perry's list, you can always overflow discussions back to the Cypherpunks list or sci.crypt.

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Adam Back
Bill Stewart
R. A. Hettinga
Tim May