At 11:53 AM 6/7/01 -0700, Jonathan Wienke wrote:

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They used I.M.I. Desert Eagles chambered for .50 Action Express. I have one in .44 Magnum, made in Israel, imported by Magnum Research, Inc.

Those are typical Hollywood guns, largely impractical. Cool looking, certainly.

Now a Barrett in .50...

Is used as cool looking, and just as impractical for anything other than infrastructure hits. A .300 Win Mag or .338 Laupa will do 1000 to 1500 yard hits just as well, in a smaller, cheaper, easier to handle package. Anything past 800 to 1000 yards is luck and voodoo anyway. -- -- http://www.apa.org/journals/psp/psp7761121.html It is one of the essential features of such incompetence that the person so afflicted is incapable of knowing that he is incompetent. To have such knowledge would already be to remedy a good portion of the offense.

At 04:56 PM 6/10/01 -0700, petro wrote:

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A .300 Win Mag or .338 Laupa will do 1000 to 1500 yard hits just as well, in a smaller, cheaper, easier to handle package.

In unknown wind? Ok.

At 1000 to 1500 yards you don't shoot in "unknown wind", you watch everything *very* carefully. Even that big ass .50 cal is going to be blown around a bit by an errant breeze, and at 3000 to 4500 feet, there are a lot of errant breezes on anything but the flattest, most open terrain.

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Anything past 800 to 1000 yards is luck and voodoo anyway.

Not me, but others, could contradict this by example.

There are so few who can hit the kinds of targets we are talking about at those ranges that it is functionally voodoo. When you get past 1k, you get massive bullet drop and even a minor wind difference can push your bullet off course, take a look at these bullet drop tables: http://www.snipercentral.com/50bmg.htm http://www.snipercentral.com/338.htm http://www.snipercentral.com/300.htm http://www.snipercentral.com/308.htm Look at how fast the bullets are dropping at 1k yards. There is an especially nice chart on the .338 page that graphically compares the four rounds. When you couple bullet drop with (in a sniper/marksman scenario) even the *slightest* unknown elevation changes, it becomes *very* *very* difficult to hit reliably hit a "bravo" sized and shaped target. When you factor in time-to-target (over a second at those ranges) it becomes even more voodoo. Then remember you've got *one* shot to hit. That first cold barrelled shot is either going to hit, or alert your target you are there. Sure, it can be done. With lots of training, luck and voodoo. Also, read what he has to say on the .50BMG page about using that round against human targets. -- -- http://www.apa.org/journals/psp/psp7761121.html It is one of the essential features of such incompetence that the person so afflicted is incapable of knowing that he is incompetent. To have such knowledge would already be to remedy a good portion of the offense.

At 05:09 PM 6/10/01, petro wrote:

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http://www.snipercentral.com/50bmg.htm

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Also, read what he has to say on the .50BMG page about using that round against human targets.

It reads like "do as I say, not as I do."

For extreme range, he doesn't say not to consider it WITH match grade ammo.

Whatever. Dream your dreams, live your fantasies. Then go to the range and try it. -- -- http://www.apa.org/journals/psp/psp7761121.html It is one of the essential features of such incompetence that the person so afflicted is incapable of knowing that he is incompetent. To have such knowledge would already be to remedy a good portion of the offense.

At 04:56 PM 6/10/01 -0700, petro wrote:

A .300 Win Mag or .338 Laupa will do 1000 to 1500 yard hits just as well, in a smaller, cheaper, easier to handle package.

The .300 Win Mag delivers about 3500 ft-lbs of energy at the muzzle. The .50 BMG delivers 13000 ft-lbs. You use a .300 Win Mag for killing people. You use a .50 BMG for taking out trucks and small structures. In other words, apples and oranges.

Anything past 800 to 1000 yards is luck and voodoo anyway.

I'm with David on this one. Maybe to me, but not to some. -- Riad Wahby rsw@mit.edu MIT VI-2/A 2002 5105