On 19 Jul, John Young wrote:

Foster's "suicide" for the Clintons, like Kelly's, is a sign that the time is ever ripe to execute the Tim May Final Option in lieu of believing what appears in the media, is told to surviving families, is joked about in the private clubs of capitals around the globe.

While I share some of Tim's apparent outrage, I am definitely not enthusiastic about the prospect of repulsive violent counter-action, which would actually be counter-productive in my opinion. It is the cycle of violence that is the problem, which is exacerbated greatly by the actions of the US administration. Anyway, I haven't been lurking for more that a few weeks, so I'm sorry if I misjudge any of you. Is there a web archive for the group? Regards, proclus http://www.gnu-darwin.org/ -- Visit proclus realm! http://proclus.tripod.com/ -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 GMU/S d+@ s: a+ C++++ UBOULI++++$ P+ L+++(++++) E--- W++ N- !o K- w--- !O M++@ V-- PS+++ PE Y+ PGP-- t+++(+) 5+++ X+ R tv-(--)@ b !DI D- G e++++ h--- r+++ y++++ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ [demime 0.97c removed an attachment of type APPLICATION/pgp-signature]

Yes supposedly, he went out to one of his regular walks and was found with a slash wrist. Something I'd imagine someone bent on offing themselves would have a) a reason to do it (and be depressed or showing signs of something being wrong), b) wouldn't go out on their normal walk which they'd do every day, c) would do it in their home, or some place private, and d) would have a note, e) would have left a will, f) be giving away money and possessions to others ahead of time, etc... Where was the knife, or razor or whatever "he used?" Was the cut done in a way that he could have done it himself? I think I remember it was on his left wrist, but am not sure, if so, was he a righty, etc.... The normal walk is a very good indicator of just what "this" was. Someone who wanted to kill him could easily use this as a predictable pattern as to when and where to grab him and kill him. Maybe he was drugged so he wouldn't struggle and be able to get help before getting his wrist slashed, etc. This was extremely badly done, regardless of how many "independent inquiries" Mr. Blair launches to cover it up^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H investigate it, it's very blatant, and unbelieveable. I'd tend to agree that this was done to send a message out, and the suicide and "inquiry" B.S. will be about as useful as the JFK assasination board, with far less of a media eye on it. Either way, Blair's credibility with the whole Iraq and Nukes is fucked. This "suicide" adds a huge dark streak to his career... Then again, he might just be as Slick as Willie, and Mr. Kelly could become another Vince Foster... time will tell... ----------------------Kaos-Keraunos-Kybernetos--------------------------- + ^ + :25Kliters anthrax, 38K liters botulinum toxin, 500 tons of /|\ \|/ :sarin, mustard and VX gas, mobile bio-weapons labs, nukular /\|/\ <--*-->:weapons.. Reasons for war on Iraq - GWB 2003-01-28 speech. \/|\/ /|\ :Found to date: 0. Cost of war: $800,000,000,000 USD. \|/ + v + : The look on Sadam's face - priceless! --------_sunder_@_sunder_._net_------- http://www.sunder.net ------------ On Sat, 19 Jul 2003, John Young wrote:

Perhaps a suicide but if so it was induced by Kelly's treatment, not only by the goofus members of parliament, but more likely by the Ministry of Defence threatening to punish him for violation of the draconian Official Secrets Act.