-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Here is my last post in this thread, because I feel that it is going nowhere: My views are irreconcilable with those of the libertarians on this list. Here's the way I view the world: 1) Life has no inherent value. Our being here is random, and there is no purpose to our lives. 2) "Human progress" is bullshit. We are no further along as a species now than we were in Plato's time. Basically, we're going nowhere fast. 3) People have no essential "rights." Rights don't exist. This is a theme often found in the work of many modern philosophers, such as Foucault. 5) Taking all three premises above, the only way I can find to evaluate what is right and what is wrong is "do what causes the least pain." I guess this is basically pragmatism. For example, if raising taxes to 95% would feed everyone in the world (I'm just speaking hypothetically), then I would advocate this, because this would lead to less pain in the world. (And I don't consider some people having to sell their Ferraris "pain." ;-) Someone here said that each time taxes are raised, we lose freedom. So what? First of all, what is "freedom"? Second of all, what is so great about it that it should be evaluated before everything else? So I guess when people say "but by making the insurance companies pay for the medical care, you are stealing from them," my answer is "So what?" I understand that this way of viewing the world is not shared by many on this list, so it seems that it would be damn near impossible for us to reach agreement. - -- Nathan Saper (natedog@well.com) | http://www.well.com/user/natedog/ GnuPG (ElGamal/DSA): 0x9AD0F382 | PGP 2.x (RSA): 0x386C4B91 Standard PGP & PGP/MIME OK | AOL Instant Messenger: linuxfu -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.4 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQE59oRA2FWyBZrQ84IRAlgUAJ9y2Tjn0jqwpSyxZD7wQW+UGQi5dQCfczrz 5fXnbFxhPFVfaFbiPu2/KNQ= =ijeO -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----