I basically agree with Duncan's noble sentiments. I just don't think it likely that the "What about the tourists?" argument will stop the national ID juggernaut once it begins to move.
The grim necessity of working for a living precludes a proper answer at this time. For now though:
Since I no longer work for a living, I can respond now :-}. (I despise smileys, but one seemed apropos here.)
"You can buy heroin in maximum security prisons." Controls don't always work.
Well, of course. But this doesn't make the prospects of "internal passports" (as I think it was you who dubbed them...or maybe Sandy) any less likely, or any less worthy of fighting. While if I were in prison, I might indeed be able to score heroin, a national ID card tied in to financial transactions, employment, driver's licenses, etc.,--"once card fits all"--would be incredibly bothersome and intrusive. And short of "going underground," with all that that implies, or leaving the country, your words of comfort about buying heroin in prison would do me little good. I was mainly saying that the "What about the tourists?" rebuttal is very weak, and is easily solved. Further, the solution for the tourist problem is actually one of he main motives for a national ID card: stopping illegal immigrants by "freezing them out" of routine economic, school, employment, and other transactions. Ditto for the point Duncan often raises, presumable semi-ironically. To wit, answering ID card checkers with a flippant "But I'm an illegal alien." "Fine," they will say, "we'll take you down to the Processing Center." (Yes, I acknowledge that local shopkeepers will not, for example, be the enforcers....in case Duncan raises the issue of there not being enough cops to do this work. But it is completely plausible that all cash register transactions could require presentation of the ID card, for various reasons (perhaps made more palatable by offering some rebate on sales taxes paid, or a VAT). Claiming one lacks a proper card will just result in a "No Sale," just as a refusal to pay the sales tax usually results in a "No Sale."...don't tell me about how some merchants will offer to eat the sales tax...try that at Safeway. (I'm not claiming Duncan will make this argument, just trying to anticipate the nitpicky wise-ass comments people often make; the fact is, most people will follow the rules, and if an ID card is made part of the economic system--as it already is for booze and cigaretters, a la age credentials--then those without an ID card will be a Real Bad Situation. Yes, anticipating rebuttals, black markets exist. But few will argue that buying most items on a black market, complete with stings, arrests, etc., is a pleasant way to live.) I for one view this prospect with alarm, and have since I read "1984' so many years ago, and then read "Shockwave" in 1975. I don't consider it too soon to think about ways to monkeywrench it. (And as an EFF member, dues all paid up, I have no hope that EFF or any of its FLA brethren will oppose this firmly. At the risk of angering our own John Gilmore, a founder of the EFF, I think EFF management is so enamored of being inside the Beltway that it will likely confine its role to providing "input" to the Gorewellian forces putting this thing together.) "National ID cards are just the driver's licenses on the Information Superhighway." --Tim May -- .......................................................................... Timothy C. May | Crypto Anarchy: encryption, digital money, tcmay@netcom.com | anonymous networks, digital pseudonyms, zero 408-688-5409 | knowledge, reputations, information markets, W.A.S.T.E.: Aptos, CA | black markets, collapse of governments. Higher Power: 2^859433 | Public Key: PGP and MailSafe available. "National borders are just speed bumps on the information superhighway."