;-) Cheers, RAH --- begin forwarded text To: rah@shipwright.com Subject: Re: BOUNCE cryptography@metzdowd.com: Approval required: From: "Perry E. Metzger" <perry@piermont.com> Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 22:57:19 -0500 User-Agent: Gnus/5.1006 (Gnus v5.10.6) Emacs/21.4 (berkeley-unix) That article is bullshit, Rob. Yes, Clinton's NSA spied on US citizens, but they got FISA approval when they did it. I would agree that FISC would approve spying on a dead goat on the basis of a white house lawyer claiming the goat was a foreign agent, but that's beside the point -- to my knowledge, they obeyed the law, as odious as the law was. Therefore, I'm not forwarding. Perry owner-cryptography@metzdowd.com writes:
From owner-cryptography@metzdowd.com Sun Dec 18 22:46:59 2005 Return-Path: <owner-cryptography@metzdowd.com> X-Original-To: cryptography@metzdowd.com Delivered-To: cryptography@metzdowd.com Received: from bullae.ibuc.com (sovereign.shipwright.com [68.167.57.91]) by blue.metzdowd.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8171C2CD68 for <cryptography@metzdowd.com>; Sun, 18 Dec 2005 22:46:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from [68.167.57.91] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bullae.ibuc.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CC8814A2E82; Sun, 18 Dec 2005 22:46:51 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <p062309d5bfcbdd86feee@[68.167.57.91]> Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 22:46:45 -0500 To: cryptography@metzdowd.com, cypherpunks@al-qaeda.net From: "R. A. Hettinga" <rah@shipwright.com> Subject: [Clips] Clinton NSA Eavesdropped on U.S. Calls Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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Delivered-To: clips@philodox.com Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2005 22:44:30 -0500 To: Philodox Clips List <clips@philodox.com> From: "R. A. Hettinga" <rah@shipwright.com> Subject: [Clips] Clinton NSA Eavesdropped on U.S. Calls Reply-To: rah@philodox.com Sender: clips-bounces@philodox.com
Reprinted from NewsMax.com Sunday, Dec. 18, 2005 10:10 p.m. EST
Clinton NSA Eavesdropped on U.S. Calls
During the 1990's under President Clinton, the National Security Agency monitored millions of private phone calls placed by U.S. citizens and citizens of other countries under a super secret program code-named
Echelon.
On Friday, the New York Times suggested that the Bush administration has instituted "a major shift in American intelligence-gathering practices" when it "secretly authorized the National Security Agency to eavesdrop on Americans and others inside the United States to search for evidence of terrorist activity without [obtaining] court-approved warrants."
But in fact, the NSA had been monitoring private domestic telephone conversations on a much larger scale throughout the 1990s - all of it done without a court order, let alone a catalyst like the 9/11 attacks.
In February 2000, for instance, CBS "60 Minutes" correspondent Steve Kroft introduced a report on the Clinton-era spy program by noting:
"If you made a phone call today or sent an e-mail to a friend, there's a good chance what you said or wrote was captured and screened by the country's largest intelligence agency. The top-secret Global Surveillance Network is called Echelon, and it's run by the National Security Agency."
NSA computers, said Kroft, "capture virtually every electronic conversation around the world."
Echelon expert Mike Frost, who spent 20 years as a spy for the Canadian equivalent of the National Security Agency, told "60 Minutes" that the agency was monitoring "everything from data transfers to cell phones to portable phones to baby monitors to ATMs."
Mr. Frost detailed activities at one unidentified NSA installation, telling "60 Minutes" that agency operators "can listen in to just about anything" - while Echelon computers screen phone calls for key words that might indicate a terrorist threat.
The "60 Minutes" report also spotlighted Echelon critic, then-Rep. Bob Barr, who complained that the project as it was being implemented under Clinton "engages in the interception of literally millions of communications involving United States citizens."
One Echelon operator working in Britain told "60 Minutes" that the NSA had even monitored and tape recorded the conversations of the late Sen. Strom Thurmond.
Still, the Times repeatedly insisted on Friday that NSA surveillance under Bush had been unprecedented, at one point citing anonymously an alleged former national security official who claimed: "This is really a sea change. It's almost a mainstay of this country that the NSA only does foreign searches."
-- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga <mailto: rah@ibuc.com> The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation <http://www.ibuc.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire' _______________________________________________ Clips mailing list Clips@philodox.com http://www.philodox.com/mailman/listinfo/clips
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-- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga <mailto: rah@ibuc.com> The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation <http://www.ibuc.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'
-- Perry E. Metzger perry@piermont.com --- end forwarded text -- ----------------- R. A. Hettinga <mailto: rah@ibuc.com> The Internet Bearer Underwriting Corporation <http://www.ibuc.com/> 44 Farquhar Street, Boston, MA 02131 USA "... however it may deserve respect for its usefulness and antiquity, [predicting the end of the world] has not been found agreeable to experience." -- Edward Gibbon, 'Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire'