I would posit that any "Cypherpunks" group arranged to "write the software for privacy" would rapidly get bogged down in the sorts of problems that Raph mentioned, as well as a host of others. The inter-person politics of the free software groups on the Internet are amazing (and something I like to avoid these days). On the technical side, what piece of software do we need for privacy? Well, anonymizing WWW re-servers. Better interfaces to secure mail. Better interfaces to the anonymous remailers. Remailer-as-delivery (e.g, mailing a delivery ticket which the recipient would have to use in order to get the message from the remailer). IPsec. Reputation & certification systems. Inter-site encryption. The list goes on (and on). And then what platform do you aim for? I see the value of the cypherpunks list as a meeting point for a wide variety of folks, each of whom is likely to go off to do work in their own area, with new perspective on the values of privacy. The value of the list as a conjunction of pro-privacy folks is much greater than it's value as a list where implementation of some application can be coordinated. If nothing else, the amount of work to be done is greater than that doable even if every member of the list sat down to write code full-time. Not that we couldn't get amazing things done, but... ObSpoilsporting over. Go for it, and best of luck to you. -- david d `zoo' zuhn --- secure computing corporation zuhn@sctc.com