RE: becoming suits. No. Cypherpunks is a unique group, don't cheapen it. Get the suits sympathetic to you (and among you) to do the suit thing. RE: change the name. Why? It is not as if cypherpunks is a cable network. It is a mailing list. Most people will never know it exists. If you send out missives for the masses, just sign them with you name, and don't put "cypherpunks" on it, if you fear it will be misinterpreted. I know how it feels. My BBS sounds like a hackers' den, but it is a clean, legal online library, and has not that much in common with the typical BBS. Sometimes I think of changing the name and then I think, "No, no Noise in the Void was the name, is the name, will be the name." If people want a Nat'l. Cryptography Assoc., let them go make one. Re: why I joined, and if it has anything to do with the name. I signed on the list, because I needed info on crypto, and sci.crypt is in- convenient (I hardly use UseNet anymore, it becomes more worthless by the second it seems.) However I did grin punkishly at the name. I like it. If the list had been Nat'l. Crypto. Assoc., I would likely have avoided it, simple because it sounds suit, and I have no patience with suits, and do not trust them. <shrug> -- Testes saxi solidi! ********************** Podex opacus gravedinosus est! Stanton McCandlish, SysOp: Noise in the Void Data Center BBS IndraNet: 369:1/1 FidoNet: 1:301/2 Internet: anton@hydra.unm.edu Snail: 8020 Central SE #405, Albuquerque, New Mexico 87108 USA Data phone: +1-505-246-8515 (24hr, 1200-14400 v32bis, N-8-1) Vox phone: +1-505-247-3402 (bps rate varies, depends on if you woke me up...:)