Cypherpunks, I have taken contention with Tim's suggestions and was glad to see the comprehensive response. And the following critiques. But I fear that AT&T and the NSA may be lovin' our discontent with each other. I still disagree with Tim on a few contentions and will post them later. But I now understand more clearly his position and far sightedness. While I did my part to start this dissent, I now hope that we can reconcentrate on the current emergency. CLIPPER! Im not saying we should quash dissent, but just cool the flames and remember our current situation. There are many facets of patent law which we may not be able to solve right now. [Eric, I am working on your research request, thanx!]. Please don't let a provacative post by a forward looking thinking derail *both* of our ultimate goals. There is a time and a place for this debate. However, I feel now we must attack the _real_ enemy. So, please, step back and remember that if we fall divided, NO ONE will voice opposition to the WIRETAP CHIP, and we can all set our calandars back to 1984. Respectfully Dissenting, Matt mjmiski@macc.wisc.edu