"terrorism" Dave: For IP, if you'd like. As an ISP, I can tell you that what the USDOJ is demanding in the article below is not only an unprecedented, vast, unwarranted intrusion that should have every citizen up in arms but would be extremely costly and in many cases simply impossible. For example, the article mentions that the DOJ wants ISPs to retain lists of the IP addresses used by every user. But we, as an ISP, do not give each user a unique IP address; we use network address translation, or NAT. To abandon the use of NAT would not only compromise users' safety (by making them more susceptible to Internet worms and other attacks); it would also require us to spend thousands of dollars to obtain more addresses from ARIN and to re-architect our network. What's more, the imposition of such a requirement upon all ISPs would instantly exhaust the remaining pool of IPV4 addresses at a time when most equipment is not ready for IPV6. The requirement that all VOIP calls be monitored is likewise absurd. We don't provide VOIP ourselves; we merely provide the pipes. We don't even know when a VOIP call is taking place on our network. We would have no way to monitor and track every one on behalf of the government, even if we were willing to (which we are not; we owe it to our users never to participate in such blatantly unconstitutional activity). Note that the government first attempted to use kiddie porn as an excuse to destroy our liberty, but seems to have decided that terrorism is a more effective excuse -- despite the fact that there have been no terrorist attacks on US soil since 9/11. The belief that everything and everyone must be monitored in the hope of preventing possible criminal activity is a hallmark of a police state. Is this what the US is coming to? If so, the 9/11 terrorists have won. By killing fewer people than died in the recent earthquake, they have given an irresponsible government an excuse to destroy our freedom, and have successfully cowed the populace into allowing it to happen. --Brett Glass ------------------ Terrorism invoked in ISP snooping proposal By Declan McCullagh http://news.com.com/Terrorism+invoked+in+ISP+snooping+proposal/ 2100-1028_3-6078229.html Story last modified Wed May 31 06:12:45 PDT 2006 In a radical departure from earlier statements, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales has said that requiring Internet service providers to save records of their customers' online activities is necessary in the fight against terrorism, CNET News.com has learned. Gonzales and FBI Director Robert Mueller privately met with representatives of AOL, Comcast, Google, Microsoft and Verizon last week and said that Internet providers--and perhaps search engines-- must retain data for two years to aid in anti-terrorism prosecutions, according to multiple sources familiar with the discussion who spoke on condition of anonymity on Tuesday. "We want this for terrorism," Gonzales said, according to one person familiar with the discussion. Gonzales' earlier position had only emphasized how mandatory data retention would help thwart child exploitation. In a speech last month at the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, Gonzales said that Internet providers must retain records to aid investigations of criminals "abusing kids and sending images of the abuse around the world through the Internet." If data retention becomes viewed primarily as an anti-terrorism measure, recent legal and political spats could complicate the Justice Department's efforts to make it standard practice. Especially after recent reports that AT&T has opened its databases to the National Security Agency, Internet and telecommunications executives have become skittish about appearing to be cooperating too closely with the federal government's surveillance efforts. In addition, the positive publicity that Google received during its legal dispute with the Justice Department over search terms has demonstrated to Internet companies the benefits of objecting to government requests on privacy grounds. "A monumental data trove is a crazy thing from a privacy perspective," said one person familiar with Friday's discussions. "It's crazy that the U.S. government is going to retain more data than the Chinese government does." Comcast said in a statement that "we fully share the attorney general's concern with the need to combat illegal use of the Internet for child pornography, terrorism and other illegal activities. We applaud the attorney general's initiative in convening an internal task force on this issue and look forward to continuing to cooperate with him and the FBI." "The reasons for skepticism are growing," said Jim Harper, an analyst at the free-market Cato Institute and member of the Department of Homeland Security's Data Privacy and Integrity Advisory Committee. He predicted the reaction among Internet and telecom companies will be "mildly unfavorable but people are not yet to the point where they'll say the emperor has no clothes." More at http://news.com.com/2102-1028_3-6078229.html?tag=st.util.print Sidebar: ISP snooping time line In events first reported by CNET News.com, Bush administration officials have said Internet providers must keep track of what Americans are doing online. Here's the time line: June 2005: Justice Department officials quietly propose data retention rules. December 2005: European Parliament votes for data retention of up to two years. April 14, 2006: Data retention proposals surface in Colorado and the U.S. Congress. April 20, 2006: Attorney General Gonzales says data retention "must be addressed." April 28, 2006: Rep. DeGette proposes data retention amendment. May 16, 2006: Rep. Sensenbrenner drafts data retention legislation, but backs away from it two days later. May 26, 2006: Gonzales and FBI Director Mueller meet with Internet and telecommunications companies. Details of the Justice Department's proposal remain murky. One possibility is requiring Internet providers to record the Internet addresses that their customers are temporarily assigned. A more extensive mandate would require them to keep track of the identities of Americans' e-mail and instant messaging correspondents and save the logs of Internet phone calls. ------------------------------------- You are subscribed as eugen@leitl.org To manage your subscription, go to http://v2.listbox.com/member/?listname=ip Archives at: http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/ ----- End forwarded message ----- -- Eugen* Leitl <a href="http://leitl.org">leitl</a> http://leitl.org ______________________________________________________________ ICBM: 48.07100, 11.36820 http://www.ativel.com 8B29F6BE: 099D 78BA 2FD3 B014 B08A 7779 75B0 2443 8B29 F6BE [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/pgp-signature which had a name of signature.asc]