the other scenerio that some certification agencies have expressed (i.e. licensing bureaus, bbb, consumer report, etc operations) is that in the online world ... that they would provide an online service .... rather than certificates designed for an offline world. the online website provides a superior experience, real-time information, and a better binding between the certification agencies and the relying parties (i.e. current use of certificates totally disintermediate the certification authorities and the relying parties .... except in the scenerio where the certification authority and the relying party are the same ... in which case the certificates are redundant and superfulous). in the shopping experience trust establishment ... trust can be established in a variety of ways, brand, advertisement, word-of-mouth, previous experience, etc. certification trust is just one of the many ways of establishing various kinds of trust. however, any certification trust in the online environment could be better provided by online certification delivery vehicle ... rather than an offline (certificate) vehicle (which disintermediates the certification agency and the relying party). "Arnold G. Reinhold" <reinhold@world.std.com> on 11/22/2000 08:00:34 AM Please respond to "Arnold G. Reinhold" <reinhold@world.std.com>