-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- when the whole sordid affair went down, particularly Dimitri's charges on faults, and my very strong "discussion" on the possibility Sameer may have cut a deal to save his own skin, thereby making C2 very insecure and very dangerous, I was subscribed to unedited, edited, flame, and announce --sorting them into separate folders just to watch. the premise was that none would be dumped: unedited was all, flame was anything which was not in the edited feed. As to sameer, I was not terribly kind as to his general morality, or the class morality as a whole. the fed hot water had mysteriously cooled off. unedited was clearly delayed during the day. I never saw dimitri's letter, and I would have, since dimitri was one of the louder (and, frankly, a bit too vituperative). there was a time I read most everything Dimitri posted just for the inanities and humour. Dimitri (dont get a fat head, sucker) is more bark than bite; did your mother repress you as a child, Dimitri? I sent one small comment on C2 backdoor possibilities for ass-saving in the wee hours, it went through. the others did not, I thought maybe I had missed it, and checked DejaVu and the archives (which are not always the best) --so I reposted in the wee hours. likewise, tim copied several of his protests which never made it to the unedited list. so, in addition to the travesty of "moderating" the free speech list, Dimitri non-withstanding, they lied to us in regards the unedited list. as for Sandy's excuse that a few blatant examples from Dimitri placed him personally in double jeopardy --that's pure hyperbole, and it's fetid. and real low for a man with a law ticket. secondly, there should have been absolutely no hold on the unedited list and therefore no liability. no question in my mind that Gilmore, Sandfort, Sameer, and whoever else had their little stinky fingers in the pie were trying to censor them all --just in varying degrees. all of their actions were reprehensible, and from my standpoint, I would not trust any of them to not kick a dog when it was down --or even pour kerosene on a cat's behind. Bad Day in Blackrock. where is Spenced Tracy and Gary Cooper when High Noon really does join The Greatest Show on Earth? -------- previous messages follow for reference --------- on or about 971006:0936 Adam Back <aba@dcs.ex.ac.uk> purported to expostulate: +Dimitri Vulis <dlv@bwalk.dm.com> writes: +> Adam Back <aba@dcs.ex.ac.uk> writes: +> > Unfortunately I wasn't on cypherpunks-unedited at the time, but I +> > thought that it was immediate send out from toad.com without going via +> > Sandy. +> +> Going over my notes I see that at least one of my submissions - the +> one quoting the C2Net lawyer letter in its entirety - didn't appear +> even on cypherpunks-unedited. +I think I saw this claim made before around the time of the "moderation +experiment". +The only ways I can see that this could have happened are either that: + i) John Gilmore started editing cypherpunks-unedited at +Sandy/C2net's + request + ii) cypherpunks-unedited was edited all along by someone (John or +Sandy) +i) is sort of feasible, perhaps there are others who were on unedited +and were counting who could confirm this. Toto I think was. +ii) is hard to believe because the fact that something is edited shows +-- when the editor is sleeping you get lag. +I'm fairly sure I didn't see the C2 legal letter you posted yesterday +before. +Can anyone else can confirm? +Adam -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: 2.6.3i Charset: latin1 Comment: No safety this side of the grave. Never was; never will be iQCVAwUBNDmZJ704kQrCC2kFAQHiFgQAtGjl5NMat+rckQk8EcIk2fvOVg9+TP4s dDVHzq+cZkrm+4Lt8h4NiypotJdZIQv6025F+Kzqsut5bGI1foIpZL3N2lGBT4Gy 082MSbk/e+5u5aWAmmUS8/e2fzX88VwuSSUnEOk8ObBWpsA5y4C+c1JgZGQLcE16 P5ezRec5T70= =HQ2M -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----