From: Will French .........In any case, it's an admission on John Gilmore's part that libertarianism can't work without some measure of authoritarianism; the only argument is over _just how much_ authoritarianism we need. .............................................. Well, as Ludwig von Mises [an economist] would put it, "The issue is not _some_ authoritarianism vs _no_ authoritariansim, but *whose* authoritarianism." Libertarianism is about individual authority. John Gilmore acted as the individual that he is. If he shouldn't act upon under his own authority, he being in the position that he is relative to the existence of the cpunks, then the list doesn't represent libertarian ideals. The list is not an institution representing a philosophy to which all participants must subordinate themselves. Au contraire, it represents an opportunity for the free exercise of reason and one's personal judgement. I think this has been a good example of that. (obviously the venerable and computer-knowledgeable Dr. Vulius can find ways to sneak back in and continue to play his fun games, thus evidencing _his_ .... judgement.) .. Blanc